tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31341356110251854.post8479152223701961522..comments2024-01-26T11:43:48.054-08:00Comments on Career Limiting Moves: Montreal Reading Report and some notes on satire, censorship and the freedom to readZachariah Wellshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02241595894807722933noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31341356110251854.post-91990761667466097572016-02-25T06:57:23.036-08:002016-02-25T06:57:23.036-08:00The hard part of defending free speech is that one...The hard part of defending free speech is that one usually only has to do it when someone abuses that right by saying something offensive. If this poem were offending a corrupt government or lampooning the tenets of a popular ideology, I'd feel a lot better about my stance. I do not.<br /><br />But there have been public calls to ban a writer from certain venues. Pressures placed on Jameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14668056976782192295noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31341356110251854.post-23328747412464647582016-02-24T07:42:03.066-08:002016-02-24T07:42:03.066-08:00Truly amazing thread. Holy smokes! some smart, sma...Truly amazing thread. Holy smokes! some smart, smart people are weighing in and doing so in an impressive manner.<br /><br />I value reading the thoughts presented here. I place highly the fact that there are very different points of view. Most of all, I embrace the fact that this discussion occurs. <br /><br />Isn't this so very much better than one side declaring the other side is of zero James Pickersgillnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31341356110251854.post-78818991686614287992016-02-22T19:13:35.780-08:002016-02-22T19:13:35.780-08:00...
If he is in fact not like that, or has not be...<br />...<br /><br />If he is in fact not like that, or has not behaved in a way which justifies this characterization, then Michael, I am sorry to say but you are coming across as some kind of piece of work. <br /><br />That's it from me. I don't have a facebook account. I don't want to get drawn in on this. What a tragedy Michael, if you just did continue with your attacks and didn&Jimnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31341356110251854.post-55434497826415127652016-02-22T19:12:54.316-08:002016-02-22T19:12:54.316-08:00Michael Nardone, I have no idea why I am writing ...Michael Nardone, I have no idea why I am writing because it seems like no matter what is put in front of you, you continue to simply demonize and throw invective towards Zach Wells. <br /><br />All I want to say as an observer who doesn't know either you or Zach (who somehow got drawn into reading about this because my partner was invited to the event on Facebook) who has spent 4 years of Jamesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31341356110251854.post-8370677906541396602016-02-22T17:57:51.435-08:002016-02-22T17:57:51.435-08:00Hi Patrick,
I think you're right that it'...Hi Patrick,<br /><br />I think you're right that it's a good idea to discuss this in person. Part of it is a values-alignment thing and part of it is semantics and part of it, maybe, can be hammered out in discussions.<br /><br />But I don't think we should **only** talk about it in person. I think we should also talk about it here, in this more-public forum, where people who find Jacob McArthur Mooneynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31341356110251854.post-10826012020755900082016-02-22T11:32:32.518-08:002016-02-22T11:32:32.518-08:00Jake,
A piece of writing does not necess...Jake, <br /> A piece of writing does not necessarily have to meet all of the criteria for satire in order for it to be satire. Literature is highly malleable and open to innovation. Deflating spurious poetics and gender/race/identity politics masked as poetics does indeed go some way towards improving humanity. In fact, the response to Zach's piece is indicative of its effectiveness Patrick Warnerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00650613771464119227noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31341356110251854.post-31897403207456992882016-02-22T09:26:39.205-08:002016-02-22T09:26:39.205-08:00When I say, "The next time I run into Zach We...When I say, "The next time I run into Zach Wells I'm going to bash his fucking skull in" it's not really me speaking, it's just a "strawman reification of certain caricatured assessments of my person and of my arguments." In fact, I dare you to identify the "I" above with 'me' the author. If you don't get this, I guess you don't understandChris Hutchinsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18426188013538584648noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31341356110251854.post-69078336700412121652016-02-22T07:56:40.369-08:002016-02-22T07:56:40.369-08:00Pat and Jacob,
I'm not sure Zach's poem i...Pat and Jacob,<br /><br />I'm not sure Zach's poem is a satire. I'd be more inclined to call it a comedy (which, admittedly, includes the use of some satire). So it's humour (though it fails to get laughs). And in the old sense of humour, it's choleric--black bile. It's a stuffed owl filled with said black bile. And, Pat, if it is meant to criticize humanity's foibles,Jameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14668056976782192295noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31341356110251854.post-73512275129613369852016-02-22T07:17:27.115-08:002016-02-22T07:17:27.115-08:00Michael is raising his own points above and identi...Michael is raising his own points above and identifies them as being separate from the talk of the poem itself, so I'll leave them alone and speak to Patrick's argument instead.<br /><br />Your standard satire definition, which I have no issue with, ends " It intends to improve humanity by criticizing its follies and foible." I do not think Citric Bitch is doing that, certainly Jacob McArthur Mooneynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31341356110251854.post-42249680865770073882016-02-22T05:18:07.881-08:002016-02-22T05:18:07.881-08:00Hi Zach, this is Michael Nardone.
I am not going ...Hi Zach, this is Michael Nardone.<br /><br />I am not going to speak to your description of the hateful poem and the events in response to it, but to say: If this is the way that you need to construct the situation so as to continue the things that you are doing, well… the various fables you are building to hold up some image of yourself will soon implode. This will especially be the case as newsAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12087031537737060349noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31341356110251854.post-30329978059581503892016-02-22T04:56:23.659-08:002016-02-22T04:56:23.659-08:00If I remember correctly, Jake, Dante's Inferno...If I remember correctly, Jake, Dante's Inferno is a catalogue of hits and take-down of the author's enemies, real and perceived. Much of it is satirical in intent. Well's poem is satire. "Satire is a technique employed by writers to expose and criticize foolishness and corruption of an individual or a society by using humour, irony, exaggeration or ridicule. It intends to improvePatrick Warnernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31341356110251854.post-49295439559035100702016-02-21T19:30:18.280-08:002016-02-21T19:30:18.280-08:00The precepts of a dramatic poem include an appeal ...The precepts of a dramatic poem include an appeal to the value of employed empathy. The dramatic character you've invented here is a continuation (albeit in a heightened, more violent, tone) of an ongoing argument you had been having with Sina at the time. It's not that people don't recognize the poem as dramatic or don't see the persona, it's just that they can see you'veJacob McArthur Mooney (Contd)noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31341356110251854.post-79250611828864029742016-02-21T19:01:38.585-08:002016-02-21T19:01:38.585-08:00" The idea was to give voice to the imaginary..." The idea was to give voice to the imaginary critic who hates women and will aggressively try to shut them up." Okay. But why did you then set that imaginary not-Zach persona off to do the bidding of attacking someone your actual real-life self took issue with? This is where the "it's just a persona" argument in favour of the poem breaks down. It's not some academic Jacob McArthur Mooneynoreply@blogger.com